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Talk:Warp drive visual effects
Warp trail merge Isn't this sort of synonymous to the concept of a warp trail? As both are terms used to refer to the byproducts left behind by a ship at warp. And this is a non-canon term for them, not even used in the film. I recognize that the effect was new and never before seen, resembling tiny luminous ice crystals floating around for a moment before dissipating, compared to the blurry luminous trail seen in the original first six films for example. 506&page 4}} and elsewhere 55&page 19}} But I think these belong to the same article never the less, as a subsection for example? since it is a common thing for effects to be updated like this in the series and not necessarily an indication that something completely never before seen is going on? -Pseudohuman (talk) 15:13, August 31, 2013 (UTC) :MA:RESOURCE states that the "sophistication of optical effects...will not affect the validity of a resource", which to me suggests that when a new visual effect is used for something already established and they don't call it out as being something different, it's the same thing. That said, I don't have a problem with this term being kept as a redirect after a merge. - 18:03, August 31, 2013 (UTC) ::Given the behind-the-scenes info we do have on this concept, warp contrails were clearly meant to be different from a warp trail, not only look different, with a unique name. They're 2 separate things, so we should deal with them as such. I therefore oppose the merge. --Defiant (talk) 15:56, October 7, 2013 (UTC) :::This article is very vague. A "physical remnant" could be an ion trail (in which merging would be the best option), or it could be something completely different (in which case, merging would depend on the type of difference). Is this article complete, or is there STID information that hasn't been added here yet? -- Cid Highwind (talk) 16:58, October 7, 2013 (UTC) Is it by the way even certain that "ion trail" and "warp trail" are synonymous. is there an episode where the terms have been actually used synonymously? Or is it more like that a warp trail is a type of ion trail? Or that warp drive produces a warp trail and an ion trail? Since according to "Relics" and "Spock's Brain" an ion trail can also be a byproduct of impulse engines or FTL ion propulsion. and then there are terms like plasma wake and warp eddy that also seem to be terms for these byproduct effects. Seems like this is an even bigger mess than this. :D --Pseudohuman (talk) 18:09, October 7, 2013 (UTC) :::I just saw STID again. Not only is the term "warp contrail" never used, the whole effect isn't addressed in any way or form. From an in-universe point of view, it is absolutely unclear whether this trail is something new (or whether it is just a new take at a decades old special effect). I support a merge in which the bginfo part gets moved to the other article. I'm not sure there's enough in-universe info to attempt a move there, but your mileage may vary. --Cid Highwind (talk) 00:41, October 9, 2013 (UTC) Ouuukay, so I tried my best to study this in depth, and edited warp trail. As it looks like to me at this point "warp trail" is the trail of residual subspace distortion left behind by warp drive, based on dialogue from : "I can retrace their warp trail, see if they met up with any other ships" & "Based on the residual subspace distortion of their warp drive, I was able to plot the course of the Maquis ship that took Dukat. As you can see, long range sensors show no signs of any other vessels travelling along that route.". "Ion trails" are the trail of ions released by warp drive, impulse drive, thrusters and almost any type of propulsion, but based on when they are left behind by a warp reactor/drive they are called warp trails too. "Scan for his ion trail" "The warp trail ends here. Gar should be directly ahead" The two are sort of combined in : "A very interesting ion trail. There's no sign of any subspace distortions in its wake. According to these readings, it's a ship without engines. You're lying, Tuvok. There is no alien ship, and there never was." What the luminous trails and these luminous ice crystals are, I have no idea. :D Are they a depiction of the ions? --Pseudohuman (talk) 13:56, October 9, 2013 (UTC) :::If we don't already have that, maybe what we need is a real world article about the various warp effects (this one, Ent-A rainbow, Ent-D rubberband and perhaps some more). This article, renamed, could become that article, or be merged with it. --Cid Highwind (talk) 14:06, October 9, 2013 (UTC) Sounds like a good idea. Real-world article: Warp drive visual effects about the evolution of how going to warp and being at warp have been depicted from the original pilot to STID. --Pseudohuman (talk) 14:48, October 9, 2013 (UTC) Contrails suggestion I suggest we create a new page about contrails. The word is referenced in the scripts of and as well as J.J. Abrams referring to the sparkly stuff in as "warp contrails". At least in my mind, it certainly doesn't have to be one or the other; we could feasibly have an article about contrails, while still retaining this page about warp drive VFX. Agreed? --Defiant (talk) 13:42, May 11, 2016 (UTC) :Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the subject not already covered on the Warp trail page? If so, a rename consideration for that page is perhaps applicable...---Sennim (talk) 16:48, May 11, 2016 (UTC) They're definitely different. In all the ENT examples (even the one from "Broken Bow", which is essentially metaphorical) as well as the TNG example, these are all inner-atmosphere instances, not at warp speeds. --Defiant (talk) 17:21, May 11, 2016 (UTC) :Ah, I stand corrected, then I've no further objections....--Sennim (talk) 20:20, May 11, 2016 (UTC) ::I don't really have an issue with this, provided the bginfo there doesn't "replace" the entry here. I remember the effects, I assume, that are being referenced in "The Forge" and "The Inner Light", and they clearly are an atmospheric effect, but what's the "Broken Bow" one? - 21:51, May 11, 2016 (UTC) The info certainly wouldn't be duplicated. The "Broken Bow" script states, "The Viewscreen shows a new GRAPHIC of the GAS GIANT – above it we can see a FRAGMENTED ION TRAIL, like a contrail that's been broken up by winds." I was assuming the reference to "winds" implied atmosphere. However, I've just realized the hypothetical winds could be solar winds. --Defiant (talk) 22:15, May 11, 2016 (UTC) :::Yes, agreed with Defiant's original suggestion. Contrails the atmospheric effect should have an article, and if a script likens warp effects to contrails then that can be mentioned in an appropriate way here or on that contrail article or in both. There's no need for things to be more complicated than that. -- Capricorn (talk) 17:31, May 12, 2016 (UTC) The script of refers to comet Icarus IV having "semi-transparent, gaseous contrails." --Defiant (talk) 15:52, October 12, 2016 (UTC)